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I thought I'd chime in on this one because there still seems to be some confusion. The EU has been aware of the problem caused by insurance companies interpretation of the 4th EU Motor Insurance Directive for quite some time. When the 5th directive was written they included a provision to allow insurance written in one member state, on a vehicle being imported into that member state from another to apply to the country of destination. This allows UK insurance companies to provide insurance cover before the vehicle enters the UK.
The UK Government was required to make this law by May 2007, in fact it became law in September 2007 by Statutory Instrument 2403 the following is a link to a pdf of this.
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If an insurance company gives an intermediary (or employee for that matter) authority to write a cover note for comprehensive insurance on the basis of a chassis number, for vehicles being imported to the UK then that cover exists from the date and time of the cover note, for the vehicle with that chassis number and for the driver or drivers named.
This removes the problem of comprehensive cover for import except, if you are importing from Germany, for example, then you need to get export registration plates because the plates belong to the person not the vehicle. Unfortunately the German authorities will not accept your UK cover note so you still end up having to buy a German Green Card (third party only insurance) just to get the export registration process completed.
In our case, you are required to drive the vehicle straight back to the UK and once in the UK you have to take it to somewhere and store it off road until you complete the UK registration process which you must do promptly.
I hope that this helps to resolve this discussion.
Best wishes
Phil Holden
Managing Director
Caravanwise Limited
Caravan Insurance and Motorhome Insurance Specialists - easy online quotes
PS I hope that including a URL to our web site is OK.
PPS I imported a Hymer B544 from Germany myself a few years ago so I've been through it myself.
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After having read the PDF doc, it's too much legal jargon for me to understand.
I spoke to Safeguard earlier today (prior to your post) for a comprehensive insurance quote based on the chassis number for a 1 year old Dethleffs Sunlight van that I will be picking up in Germany in a few days. They answered when asked, that they do not cover the van whilst still in Germany on the return visit.
Are you suggesting that my van will be covered regardless of them saying that it won't?
Regards,
Dan.
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Welcome to MHF and thanks for posting that very useful explanation and the link to SI2403. I haven't read it as yet but will try to later on.
I'm still not sure that the situation is entirely clear. As I understand it, your saying that if an insurer allows an intermediary (broker) to write a cover note on a new vehicle (unregistered in the UK) using the VIN number as identification, then that cover is operative from the start date & time on the cover note, regardless of whether the vehicle is in the UK or has ever been in the UK?
The other point needing clarification is the German one. Virtually all personal M/H imports into the UK are from Germany and as you say, the German system requires that you purchase export plates and third party insurance. Now there is this other principle that exists in UK insurance practice that deems it to be unacceptable to insure a vehicle under more than one policy at the same time. So if someone were to have a mishap on the way back from buying a vehicle abroad would the UK insurer refuse to consider the claim on the basis that the vehicle was already insured under the German policy? I'm sure that the logical position would be that the German policy would cover the third party claims and the UK policy the 1st party element - but I'm a sceptic.
BTW: Unfortunately you can't include a link to your website under the forum rules so I'll have to delete it, but you can include the link in your members profile. If you include the link in your profile it will appear in the form of a WWW link button at the bottom of all your posts.
Are you suggesting that my van will be covered regardless of them saying that it won't?
Hi Dan,
No. If they say you are not covered you are not covered. You have to disclose all material facts and your importation is a material fact that would affect their decision to grant cover. If they would not have granted cover, if you had told them something, that you should have, then they can repudiate any claims.
The opposite is also true. If you tell an insurance intermediary everything and they still provide a cover note on that basis then cover would be in place even if they made a mistake. That's why we have professional indemnity insurance.
Best wishes
Phil
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UK insurers have to contribute to a fund (MIB) to compensate the victims of uninsured drivers.
As I understand it, if UK insure non uk registered vehicles as provided by the EU directive they would have to contribute to the equivalent fund in the EU country or countries concerned. Perhaps another example of ill thought through legislation and may explain why insurers are reluctant to do this
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I'm still not sure that the situation is entirely clear. As I understand it, your saying that if an insurer allows an intermediary (broker) to write a cover note on a new vehicle (unregistered in the UK) using the VIN number as identification, then that cover is operative from the start date & time on the cover note, regardless of whether the vehicle is in the UK or has ever been in the UK?
Hi Gaspode,
Yes, but see my comment above. It's all about acceptance of the "risk" and you must disclose all material facts therefore if you mislead the intermediary then cover would not be in place.
gaspode wrote:
The other point needing clarification is the German one. Virtually all personal M/H imports into the UK are from Germany and as you say, the German system requires that you purchase export plates and third party insurance. Now there is this other principle that exists in UK insurance practice that deems it to be unacceptable to insure a vehicle under more than one policy at the same time. So if someone were to have a mishap on the way back from buying a vehicle abroad would the UK insurer refuse to consider the claim on the basis that the vehicle was already insured under the German policy? I'm sure that the logical position would be that the German policy would cover the third party claims and the UK policy the 1st party element - but I'm a sceptic.
I wouldn't worry about that as it would be up to the insurance companies to sort it out between themselves. All you need to be sure of is that any claim for damage to your motorhome would be paid for by the UK insurer and that would definitely be the case if you disclose that the reason you want a comprehensive cover note on a chassis number is because you are importing from Germany and the cover note is granted on that basis.
Thinking about this now, after the event, I think that technically you may be misleading the third party (Green Card) insurer by taking out their cover when you know there is cover already in place, but the whole process is done in German and I for one don't know what questions I was asked, so I can't be sure.
The problem boils down to this: The Germans require a cover note with the temporary registration number on it and they will not issue that number in advance so you end up doing a walk around various offices in order to get the number, then somewhere to get a cover note with the number on it and the plates, then back to the registration office to get the plates authorised with stamps and stickers. As far as I know you have to do all of this in person.
Again, as far as I know, it is only permissible for a UK cover note to have the chassis number or the UK registration number and you cannot obtain a UK registration until the vehicle is in the UK.
They don't make it easy do they!
Best wishes
Phil
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Have just phoned Coversure at Nuneaton and spoke to Craig who says yes they can definitely do it on a chassis no. and you will be covered fully comprehinsive from when you collect the vehicle in the EU but you need to supply them with the UK Reg No. within 7 days or the insurance company will cancel your policy and charge you cancellation fees. He says this is because british insurance companies have to register every vehicle insurance policy with the government insurance database within the 7 days or they get fined by the government. This I find bazaar as before you can register the vehicle you have to contact the VAT and get a price from them, pay them, get a receipt. As when you apply with your V55/4 you must include a current british motor insurance certificate plus evidence of paying VAT.
He says people have done it in the past within the 7 days. I would be grateful to know how this is possible.
Derek
(I thought we were all in the EEC and trade was to made simple between each country!!!!)
The bit about seven days to register insurance is not only bizarre it is not correct. You have 14 days to register a vehicle once it is covered and it is on the motor insurance data base, do not think this is a govenment thing. I have imported vehicles from Japan and provided you have invoices and papers you can pay vat and car tax before you have the vehicle.
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I imported a used campervan from Germany in March last year. The UK insurance situation was a total nightmare.
1. Before I set off to Germany to collect the van, I got UK fully comprehensive cover on the chassis number via Adrian Flux but that only came into effect once I reached Dover. With the help of the German dealer I had taken out temporary 3rd party German insurance and number plates valid for 28 days. Not a comfortable feeling, driving 300 miles back to Calais in an unfamiliar van with only 3rd party cover.
2. In my case, getting the van converted to pass the UK MoT took 6 weeks, mainly due to the difficulty of getting a suitable speedo face conversion. The van is a LHD Auto T4. The overlay I had bought wasn't quite right for that model, so I got a specialist company to make a new speedo face in acrylic showing kph/mph. The result is excellent - just like a pukka VW one, and the backlighting, colours, all warning lights + trip computer features look spot on, so in my view worth the outlay. The problem was the time it took.
3. Meanwhile, I got a letter saying that as I hadn't supplied details of my UK registration within 14 days, my UK insurance policy had been cancelled. Nightmare. Well, sleepless nights, actually.
4. Eventually I got the policy reinstated with a 7 day extension to get the van registered or else. There was a condition requiring the van to be stored in my garage - not enough clearance around the door to allow the van into the garage; catch-22!
5. Big sigh of relief once I had a registration number to give to Adrian Flux.
Incidentally, my local DVLA office staff had tightened up their checking of all the conversion work. I would not have got away with LHD headlights + beam converters, or amateur mph markings on the speedo. They were however friendly and helpful.
RANT:
UK motorcaravan insurers need to get their act together and make it a painless, more customer needs-oriented process. All the restrictive conditions and obstacles are an utter pain in the neck. How on earth do they assume a MH will fit in a domestic garage?
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Nightmare. Well, sleepless nights, actually.
