Flood Damaged Tributes Forums

SimpsonBrothers

Why oh why is everybody getting the wrong end of the stick?

These motorhomes were bought directly from Auto-Trail & not from an Insurer. They would have had to have been returned to Italy to effect any repairs that were needed and were part of a large Insurance claim only in so far as to the repairs assessed as necessary to render them suitable for retailing as "brand new" through Aut-trail's dealer network. Let's not forget that Auto-Trail is wholly owned by Trigano who manufactured these MH's - so I expect they were quite happy to sell 83 brand new MHs at a decent discount rather than have them transported all the way back to Italy. Most of these MH's have no visible damage to them. Ultimately, we have 35 years of experience in this highly specialised Trade & operate from exemplary premises covering 43.7 acres with a total on-site capacity of around 12,000 vehicles. We always trade with utmost integrity and are totally transparent regarding every aspect of these MHs. All customers enquiring about this current batch of MHs are welcome to read all emails pertaining to our purchase from Auto-Trail including the very specific questions that were asked of Auto-trail prior to our purchasing these vehicles from them: we've nothing to hide! We were very happy that Autop-Trail accepted our offer for the 86 vehicles (including 3 used ones) and believe that we are selling them onwards at a respectable market saving to our customers.
In terms of clarification:

1. These vehicles are not "written off" or Insurance "total losses". They are not categorised under the ABI/BVSF Code of conduct for Salvage categorisation as they are being sold as new vehicles but devoid of all warranties.

2. Values! Well...... that's very difficult. All I can say is that I was happy to pay what I did for them & am happy for any sensible inspection by potential purchasers. I believe I'm selling them at a sensible market value (& the fact that I've sold over a quarter of them within 3 weeks which included Xmas & new Year does suggest that I'm right!) I'd rather someone did not buy from me who is not happy with my transparent approach!

3. How deep were they flooded? We didn't see them when they were affected by water so can only judge by looking carefully at the vehicles. I'm sure the actual depth of water will have varied, but most have no obvious height or tide lines. Indeed, I've carefully checked behind bumpers for tell-tail signs & in radiator fins for signs of sediment - a majority have no visible signs. We do, however, have 3 or 4 motorhomes that have more major flood damage - but these are not currently for sale & will be clearly described as having significant flood damage (that same transparancy again!).

4. One poster says "My local dealer told me they had all the chassis numbers of the veichles that had been scrapped" - simply factually incorrect! I do, however, understand why Auto-trail dealers are less than happy - their MH's are priced at a huge amount more than mine: I certainly know which I'd rather be selling (& I am selling mine - are they?)!

5. One poster says "Put it like this, if there had been nothing wrong with these vans why did the manufacturers wash their hands of them ? (excuse the pun) and the insurance company sign them off as a loss and they were sold to salvage regardless of what cat they are. "
Reply: Sorry - wrong end of that stick again!. We are assessing the MHs as best we can & finding most to be unaffected by the flood water - but many of them do, as we've said, need repairs. The Insurers did NOT sign them off as a loss. Oh, and yes - wrong again about categorisation - sorry.

6. One poster says: "I wonder what Auto-Trail mean by "Seriously Contaminated Flood Water" or have they got it wrong as well."
Answer: Yes - I wonder as well! Certainly Auto-Trail mentioned that they were "flood affected" when they were selling them to us. Interestingly, there was no suggestion whatsoever of "Seriously Contaminated Flood Water" at any time prior to their receiving our money in payment. Indeed, quite the opposite!! (and all emails & other paperwork is here & available for serious purchasers to read through should they wish to) Ah - it's that transparancy thing again!

7. One poster says "At £7000-00 off the retail list price it is just not worth it. No warranty on anything so if it goes wrong it is your expensive problem and there is no knowing when something else will fail and you have got to find someone who will fix it and there are enough comments on this site about dealers only wanting to know MH's they have supplied."
Reply: a valid opinion & respected as such. I guess that's down to a personal preference as to whether you buy a 2 or 3 year old motorhome (which is similar money) or a new one such as these & take your chance regarding something going wrong. But it is that same risk on an older MH as it will also be running out of warranty, & it's history may well be unknown. With these, you know exactly what you're buying (transparancy!)

8. The chap who likened this damage to flood damage of a house & also mentioned "health issues". Appreciate the opinion, but we're talking something totally different here. Put simply, the two things are not similar at all. I am totally unaware of any issues regarding the contamination of these vehicles & would be the first to agree that anything with the degree of contamination he's referring to is simply scrap. Indeed, I was involved in an advisory capacity with the vehciles that were seriously flooded in the South a few months ago & recommended that many of them were crushed (which they were!) Ultimately, these vehicles speak for themselves - as anyone who has looked closely at them will testify.

9. My thanks to "Steve the Jacket" for his positive efforts to keep the comments posted here correct (as well as others). Thanks also to George Hinton, deputy editor of the Caravan Club magazine, for holding his hand up when he got it totally wrong and for doing everything he can to make amends for his incorrect article.

I am proud to run an honest business to the best integrity that I can. I will gladly answer any further questions that anybody might have.
Bruce Simpson

Moderator Edit: “The contents/partial contents of this post have been removed by moderators due to possible contravention of the site policy on advertising. Please contact a moderator if you have any queries.”

Rapide561

Hi

Thanks for the input.

Russell

carolgavin · Quiz Queen

Hi and welcome to motorhomefacts. Like Russell says thank you for your comprehensive posting.Iadmire your transparency, its rare these days. Nice to see all prospective purchasers can see the communications with Auto-Trail.

maddie

Hi Bruce Simpson, welcome,nice post!
just to claify
never registered?(new)not on no nasty list?(come sell time) and some £7k cheaper but no warenty?(7k does a lot of repairs)
terry

Otto-de-froste

Hi Tribute-550
As mentioned by our colleague Mr Tribute_650 our van is for sale.
4500 miles, and in pristine condition.

It is not flood damaged, and has the balance of a manufacturers warranty.

It is worth considering the resale of any vehicle when the time comes to part with it too.

Not knocking any others, but it is a genuine vehicle and a genuine sale.

Ours has an awning, bike rack, ariel, CD, as extras, and we will even throw in a free standing awning.

If you wish to look at it or discuss it please leave a message here. We will be realistic on price.

Otto-de-froste.

Tribute_650

Hi SimpsonBrothers (Bruce) and it is good to see you contributing, as I said in a previous post, I have found you a "decent bunch"

quote : "Why oh why is everybody getting the wrong end of the stick?"

Well, I think you need to speak to the manufacturer and get them to change the information they are putting out on these vans if everything is as you say. Also ask them why they feel they need to actively alert everyone to the chassis numbers if they are not problem vehicles. I think most of the worries people have voiced on this and other threads have come from that information. I have seen it on Trigano Tribute CI and autotrail web sites & announcements.

Not trying to be rude but It does not help the vehicles credentials that the nature of your business is salvage if you see what I mean.

Maybe It would help if you could provide a warranty through one of the specialist insurance companies, I have had a few of them from dealers on used cars.

cheers
650

SimpsonBrothers

Terry: Thanks for the post

To confirm:

Yes - These vehicles are new & unregistered and were bought directly from Auto-Trail: the invoice & all purchase correspondence was from them. The bank transfer was directly into their account.We have the correct paperwork to register although DVLA interpret what that is differently depending on which local office you go to to register. Initially, we specifically asked Auto-Trail prior to purchase how these would be registered. They, in turn, asked SMMT (Society of Motot manufacturers & Traders) to get a definitive answer from DVLA. The response was (I quote) "....because the majority of these vehicles had not been registered before, they will have the latest registration plates when they are eventually registered." Based upon that advice, we went ahead with buying them. Prior to purchasing these from Auto-trail, I found them to be upfront & they appeared totally helpful in every way even to the extent that they forwarded various emails to me "As I want to be completely transparent" in their words. Regretably, Auto-Trail have since proved to be most unhelpful and have refused all my reasonable requests for help in sorting out problems that have arisen with DVLA offices as well as refusing point blank to post clarification of the status of these vehicles on their website. I HAVE ALL THE EMAILS & I AM TRANSPARENT!!! Anyone wishing to view the various emails are welcome to - I've nothing to hide.

Regarding these being "on nasty lists" - these are NOT total losses. Prior to purchase, I have an email in which Auto-trail clarified that:
"The vehicles have NOT been "written off" by the insurance company."
Obviously, the Auto-Trail dealer network will always have the chassis numbers of these & may (or may not) be helpful: at the end of the day, they are hardly the happiest of bunnies right now as they are trying to sell their vehicles at full-up retail against ours which are heavily discounted!

Interestingly, you say "£7k does a lot of repairs" and you're right. regarding the Silver Tributes, I'm not sure that there is much wrong at all with most of them. Clearly, our customers have as long as they need to fully inspect them prior to purchase and I welcome feedback from any of them as to how much they anticipate spending in repairs. Obviously, as we sell them then the choice becomes restricted. We had 25 Tributes & have sold 11 of them already. Whilst I expect that these 11 sold were the pick of the bunch, the rest still look pretty good to me!

best regards

Bruce

SimpsonBrothers

650 - thanks again for your input - valid points!

I really hoped for some cooperation from Auto-Trail regarding clarification of their statement which was posted without our knowledge - but have not received any help at all. On the 4th January, I sent them the following DRAFT copy (which I must point out is entirely my words and they refused to post):

"Flood Damaged Motorhomes – Clarification statement

Previous statements issued may have been misinterpreted and we wish to clarify the situation regarding the status and condition of these vehicles.

The freak weather conditions affected these Motorhomes to varying degrees and some appeared to have comparatively little damage. All these vehicles became a part of an Insurance claim as the damage to them was such that we were not in a position to continue to deal with them as new vehicles for onward sale through our dealer network. Indeed, for us to effect repairs to an acceptable standard would have involved their return to the factory in Italy. Further to discussions with our Insurers and loss adjusters, we, therefore, chose to sell them directly to Simpson Bros (York) Ltd as vehicles requiring repair and devoid of all warranty both on the base vehicle and the habitation. These vehicles are not “written-off”: for the reasons stated above, we were compensated the full cost value by our Insurance company and Simpson Bros (York) Ltd."

Auto-Trail's extremely unhelpful response to what I believe was my wholly resonable request was they "...believe that our awareness statement is accurate and correct, it has been checked by our insurance company and authorised by our Head Office, therefore we do not feel it necessary to expand further."

Well, thanks for that! Whilst I have absolutely no problems with them being totally transparent, it would have been nice to have had some input into their posting/press release.

In terms of warranties, there are various warranties available - but it is not something I've much knowledge of. Should anyone iout there know much about these or be able to recommend any specific compamies, then I'm pleased to pass these details on to prospective purchasers.

Regards being rude about the very nature of our business being salvage, you're not: that is exactly what our core business is - simple as that. Whilst our company is correctly named "Simpson Bros (York) Ltd, we trade pretty much everywhere as "Simpson Salvage". I appreciate that this may not be helpful for a vehicles credentials should someone wish to be less than truthful about a vehicle's origins!

Best regards

Bruce