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LeoK

Apparently I have a 'loop fault' affecting my broadband access. The failure is intermittent, but not the issue for now. The problem is currently diagnosed as being ‘my’ side of the master line box, and BT want to send an ‘engineer’ to check my wiring and devices. (Yes, I have been round the unplugging things loop until the path is too compacted for grass to grow.)

The last time that I was painted into this corner it cost me fifty pounds to have two IDC joints remade. Otherwise, all was well.

BT now want to charge 144 ukp (plus vat), which I find gross. I can probably buy the appropriate tools for much less. If I recall, they used a transmitter device clipped to the ‘master pair’ and a tracing device to find out just where the signal went and, likely, the signal strength at that point.

Could one, or more, of the assembled experts please point me to the appropriate specialist tools.

bigfoot

If memory serves(GPO engineer-pre digital) You are looking for a short circuit,use a multi meter on resistance setting and work you way up the circuit until it goes. It is then in that section.

Steptoe

Firstly confirm that the fault is indeed your side of the line box by plugging your broadband into the engineering socket (remove the lower rectangular faceplate of the master socket to expose this) you may of course need to buy an telephone extension lead to be able to do this and no other sockets will work.

If you are then confident this has cleared the fault you can then check all your connections/internal circuitry. The IDC insertion tools are available from RS Spares or Screwfix, or you can get a cheap version with some DIY extension kits, and I have heard of folks using a small electrical screwdriver Shocked

Don't forget to check the connections on the back of the faceplate you took off, these are the usual ones to give problems.

cabby

If you have the free paper called Friday ad or similar up there, then you should see an ex BT engineer advertising a service cheaply.

cabby

LeoK

Thank you all for your helpful suggestions.

Using the BT online line test I have established that there is no reported fault when the test socket of the line box is empty.

I have also established that, with no devices connected, pins two+five are open circuit throughout the internal wiring. Also, when I short pins two+five behind the linebox and check for resistance at the extreme of the internal circuit I measure maybe 0.014 ohms more that with the meter shorted. I am willing to interpret this a negligible resistance given the likely accuracy of the meter.

I have just tried the BT online test again with the linebox reassembled but with nothing plugged into any socket. No fault found. Not a major surprise, there is only wire tested after all.

Broadband worked when directly into the test socket, but it would wouldn't it. That's the problem with intermittent.

Sadly, the symptoms manifest as lost connection (sync from the router), or lost data – but all intermittently, well since late august anyway. Neither ISP, BT nor I can find a problem, so I am thinking that maybe broadband really is a function of the state of the tide, the temperature in the mountains and positions of the planets.

Does anyone know better ?

Not to denigrate the helpful suggestions from you very nice people here.

By the way, I would like to be able to what the Friday Ad man can do, but for myself.

Steptoe

LeoK,

If you can't find a fault with your comprehensive tests then I would suggest it is not worth getting a 'professional' in, they can carry out no more checks than you have done. The 'transmitter' you referred to in your first post was probably a tone generator, a excellent piece of equipment for finding one pair of wires amongst hundreds, but for proving the integrity of a known pair, not as good as a meter (can't determine resistance only show open circuit)

The crux to solving your problem is to determine whether your internal wiring or the wiring to the exchange is the problem. You are obviously fairly competent and independant minded Cool

so I will only suggest what I would do rather than tell you what to do.

I would log the frequency and timing of the broadband dropout, if it happens at a regular time or day there might be a clue there. I would then run the broadband from the engineering socket for a sufficient period of time until the fault either occurred or I was sure that it was not going to occur.

If the fault was proved to the internal wiring then I would look to problem spots, kinks, under carpet runs, cleats through cable etc, damp bits, or else just replace the whole run with new. If the fault was proved to the BT wiring, I would tell them that I had been using the engineering socket and was still experiencing the fault and would they recheck their cabling.

Best of luck, intermittant faults are a pain to find

LeoK

Thanks Steptoe,

I have tried logging observed occurrences but failed to find any consistency, although I have only been able to take observations when I am present to watch the lights, and at the end of the internal circuit.

I have not yet tried lengthy observations using the engineering socket, but that is obviously the way forward. Unfortunately I have to connect the telephone again also - for sake of harmony as they say.

Again, thanks all.

JP

Hi
I have a friend who is a BT engineer and he tells me the two most likely causes of this fault are a sky box and your router/modem both made by the million and often poor quality control.
JP

LeoK

Well JP, so funny that you should say that.

Because of the intermittent nature of the problem I am currently working with all of the internal wiring connected (no fault from BTs self test) one DSL splitter into the line box (the inboard socket not the test socket), one telephone and Sky box into the ‘phone side of the splitter and the router into the DSL side.

Having spent an hour or so reading the inbound emails I attempt to send replies at, say, 22:25ish. Behold, no sync. Disconnected 'phone and Sky, power cycled router. Behold, sync reappears and mail gets sent.

By reconnecting ‘phone and Sky I kill the sync. Have now demonstrated that I can kill the sync by connecting the Sky box and restore the sync by disconnecting the Sky. Seems to demonstrate the very point which you make.

But why is this only at random times on random days ? I would bet that neither Sky nor Thompson (maker of the box) will know, but at least I can record better observations now that I am closer to the apparent cause. I wonder how long it will take Sky to notice that it is not connected ….

And how miffed they will be when I want the (almost) full hard drive put into the replacement box.

JP

Hi
Apparently Sky boxes are the usual cause of problems and as you say it would cost you a lot of money for a BT engineer to tell you this. The problem the engineers have is that at one time most of them would find the cause, tell you then log it as a fault on their system to save you the cost. Now they have a bonus system in place and if the same fault is reported again they loose their bonus so as you can expect they now charge you rather than loosing out them selves. Sky usually takes months to notice you have not got your box plugged in and then send you a letter. All you need to do is plug your box in over night for a week and all should be ok for a few more months. If you are out of your 12 month contract you have no problem anyway.
JP