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Motorhome Facts Forum Index » Base Chassis (Fiat/Mercedes/Iveco etc) » Ducato/Boxer transmission and reversing problems Goto page : Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 76, 77, 78 ... 274, 275, 276  Next
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492628 Post Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:23 am Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

reeventu  


Joined: Nov 20, 2007

Posts: 283

MH: Nu Venture Calleta

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I have just been advised by freeborns that citroen have confirmed that they will change the gearbox / flywheel and clutch .

The gearbox is to have a different reverse ratio????

the van goes in on Monday for retun on tuesday .

All parts are with Freeborn's.

I understand the cost is approx £3500
 Fiat / Peugeot juddering
492639 Post Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 9:50 am Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

TARMACKID  


Joined: Dec 27, 2007

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I havent seen it mentioned that in the September issue of The Caravan Club Magazine the following item appears.

PEUGEOT BOXER GEARBOX UPDATE

We heard from Peugeot just after the August Edition went to press as follows; "WE WILL SHORTLY BE RELEASING A SOFTWARE DOWNLOAD WHICH IMPROVES THE ENGINE'S TORQUE OUTPUT AT LOWER REVS. THIS IMPROVES THE TAKE-UP OF DRIVE BUT A NEW, LOWER, REVERSE GEAR IS ALSO BEING DEVELOPED. BOTH OPTIONS WILL BE AVAILABLE AS A RETRO-FIT TO CURRENT CUSTOMERS' VEHICLES. NEW VEHICLES COMING OUT OF THE FACTORY, HOWEVER, WILL BE BUILT WITH A LOWER REVERSE GEAR AS STANDARD"
 
492706 Post Posted: Thu Sep 25, 2008 12:05 pm Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

Broom  


Joined: Oct 08, 2007

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Hi All

Been speaking to a Fiat service manger in York who during our conversation said that Fiat had already tried replacement gear boxes of various types and this had not rectified the judder problem, its seems to be more complexed than just the reverse gear ratio.

Not sure he new what he was on about but proves Fiat are at the very least trying to resolve matters.

I also mentioned the bump on cold start which seems to have taken a back seat, and the ongoing water ingress via the windscreen scuttle.

Best Regards
Broom
 Ducato/Boxer Reverse Judder
493235 Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 11:07 am Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

wenlock  


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Hi All
The post has just come including a letter from Emma Toms, Customer Care Director, Fiat Proffessional.
She states that,
"We have received feedback from yourself and some other Fiat Ducato Motorhome owners, of a vibration when reversing their vehicle. Some describe this as 'clutch judder' and it may only be felt when reversing uphill.
The feedback has been received from only a very small minority of Motorhome owners,however we take comments of this nature very seriously and therefore our Technical Services team in Italy are currently investigating.
This letter is just to confirm that investigations are underway and that we will provide further detailed information once the results are available. As yet, there are no timescales for these findings but please be assured that we will be in touch again as soon as we have any further information.

We appreciate your patience in this matter whilst we investigate the causes fully."

To me this is the first official admission that there is a problem and that some form of action is being contemplated.
Comments please.
Paul
 Re: Ducato/Boxer Reverse Judder
493261 Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 12:07 pm Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

ICDSUN  


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wenlock wrote:
Hi All
The post has just come including a letter from Emma Toms, Customer Care Director, Fiat Proffessional.
She states that,
"We have received feedback from yourself and some other Fiat Ducato Motorhome owners, of a vibration when reversing their vehicle. Some describe this as 'clutch judder' and it may only be felt when reversing uphill.
The feedback has been received from only a very small minority of Motorhome owners,however we take comments of this nature very seriously and therefore our Technical Services team in Italy are currently investigating.
This letter is just to confirm that investigations are underway and that we will provide further detailed information once the results are available. As yet, there are no timescales for these findings but please be assured that we will be in touch again as soon as we have any further information.

We appreciate your patience in this matter whilst we investigate the causes fully."

To me this is the first official admission that there is a problem and that some form of action is being contemplated.
Comments please.
Paul

Paul

Probably damage limitation with a major show coming up, they do monitor the forums Hi Guys Laughing

I could be totally wrong and find that Fiat have changed there position and actually do give a damn about their customers

Regards

Chris
 re Fiat
493290 Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 12:55 pm Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

silversurfa  


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Have had 5 Fiat cars 3 m/hs, not a problem with any of them, But I do think that anyone that can ruin a clutch and gearbox reversing up a hill ! needs to be taught how to drive correctly. A lack of adhesion with front wheel drive vehicles on a steep Incline is because of weight transfer or power to weight ratio , you just can't add more weight to the driving wheels , but I can't see why they cannot add an auto diff lock.
 Ducato/Boxer Reverse Judder
493305 Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 1:30 pm Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

wenlock  


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ICDSUN
Good point, although the statements in the letter, whilst not definitive, do go further than the brush off line about reving to 1300 rpm etc.
I think we as owners have got to the point where we realise that this problem is not (wholly) attributable to inexperienced drivers or driver error.
I would strongly refute any such argument directed at myself.
Lets hope that you are right and they have changed their position.
By the way I am too old to believe in Santa Claus.
Paul
 Re: re Fiat
493307 Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 1:34 pm Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

ICDSUN  


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silversurfa wrote:
Have had 5 Fiat cars 3 m/hs, not a problem with any of them, But I do think that anyone that can ruin a clutch and gearbox reversing up a hill ! needs to be taught how to drive correctly. A lack of adhesion with front wheel drive vehicles on a steep Incline is because of weight transfer or power to weight ratio , you just can't add more weight to the driving wheels , but I can't see why they cannot add an auto diff lock.

Hi

Perhaps you as an expert Fiat owner would care to teach us judderer's how to drive correctly, having driven an average of 40k per year for the last 39 years in a variety of vehicles and countries I find your suggestion most welcome, I do not consider that this level of experience alone excludes me from achieving your elevated position, I think I am a reasonably average driver, but if you can show me that you can indeed reverse my MH without judder and without slipping the clutch I would be eternally grateful, as others would be also I feel sure.

I and other owners have obviously been unlucky to also find that the dealers who have tested our vehicles are also afflicted and in need of your expert tuition, my vehicle judders on the level so maybe I really am in dire need of your expertise. I have on occasion become elevated nearly to your level with some Fiat X250 based motorhomes, as under my control they did not judder when I have tested them, but sadly I fell back to bad ways as some still juddered despite my best efforts.

Incidentally there is evidence that empty panel vans with just a driver and fuel operating well within their design tolerances also judder on a slight incline which does not fit the weight/frontaxle ratio argument to the point of detriment on those vehicles.

Anyway back to the issue of driving tuition

Please help us unworthy judder infested owners and let us know when you are starting your tuition so we can all turn up and give you the necessary respect you deserve as "the enlightened one", also what are the costs or as I suspect, as a gesture of goodwill you are doing this for free so our roads will not be littered with juddering motorhomes and their afflicted drivers.

What size hard hat do you need? Wink

Chris
 
493337 Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 2:39 pm Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

AndyStothert  


Joined: Feb 09, 2008

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As probably the most decorated and recognised very worst owner/driver of a Fiat Ducato motorhome (MWB panel van weighing a paltry 2500kg) and having chewed my way through three gearboxes and a new clutch to date I would welcome any kind of driving instruction.
Strange though that our last but one van, a Transit managed to resist my attempst to wreck it by driving badly for a total of 220,000 miles without gearbox or clutch. And the Mercedes before that for 70,000. And of course our 13 year old Peugeot 205 which remains untouched and virginal in the clutch and gearbox. But there we are - obviously I'm getting worse with age.
However the reason for this post is that I too have received a letter from Fiat which just about admist they are acknowledging that small number of vehickles (mine included) ahve a defect.
After speaking to the one of the bosses at Fiat UK today and getting the letter I'm fairly confident that when the new gearbox is ready (presently being tested) we (the whingers) will get a new gearbox which is capable if reversing up something steeper than a 1 in 6 without dismantling itself.

The new box should be ready for the production line in January subject to the tests of course) and after that we we will see if Fiat and Peugeot are willing to stand by their declaration (yesterday, but unofficial) that they wil stand by their customers.
The reason why we aren't (ever) going to get an official statement from Fiat about this is that it would be tantamount to admitting that they are continuing, knowingly, to build a defective vehicle.
But it does look as though the modified gearbox and clutch will fit existing vehicles and that after January Fiat will be quietly fitting them to the vans owned by the those who have made a complaint.
This does leave all sorts of unanswered questions (about the vast majority of unmodified one son the secondhand market) but the main reason I started all this was to get our vans fixed, and it now looks as though that will eventually happen.
 reversing judder - fiat & peugeot
493362 Post Posted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 4:08 pm Thank this member for this postReply with quote Add User to Ignore List Back To Top

Otto-de-froste  


Joined: May 20, 2005

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Can't be a****d to trawl all the way through these topics, and apologies if it's already been mentioned but:

In this months C&CC magazine there is a letter regarding Fiat/Peugeot issues

Peugeot dealers are reputedly providing a software download to improve engine torque at idle

If this doesn't solve the problem a lower ratio first gear kit will be installed

The Fiat boffins are apparently still pontificating

Oddly enough our Tribute 650 had a flat spot immediately when pressing the accelerator, which caused the van to lurch a little especially in stop-start traffic

The new Bessacarr has a nice smooth delivery

O de F
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