[bilbaoman]

Meanwhile harmful pollution from wood burners goes unchecked this is not about pollution as even so called green transport gives off harmful pollution from tyre and brake particles its about revenue

 

[raynipper]

Isn't 'Nature' responsible for a lot of wood burning?

Ray.

 

[erneboy]

There's chat about the regulation of wood burners. https://www.idealhome.co.uk/house-m...-wood-burning-stove-regulations-pound300-fine

It will be interesting to hear how enforcement goes.

 

[rayc]

Apparently the mayors office say "94% of vehicles seen driving in the current zone now meet the strict emissions standards on an average day, significantly higher than the 39% in 2017 when the ULEZ was first announced. This has helped to reduce harmful nitrogen dioxide pollution by nearly half in central London."

It has off course also reduced the projected revenue income.

Note how selective the figures are. First they talk about the "current zone" and then "central London". They are trying to imply pollution levels have fallen by nearly half in the current zone which is not the case. traffic levels in central London fell off dramatically over the last few years due to Covid.

 

[Pat-H]

Of course if these cities had the public transport infrastructure they should have running at an affordable subsidized rate. There would be far less justification or need to sit in massive traffic schemes.
London does have good transport links of course. But the privatisation of bus routes has seriously undermined the ability to travel point to point in a timely cost effective way.
It is sad that we still value human life so low that profit is king.

 

[rayc]

London does have good transport links of course. But the privatisation of bus routes has seriously undermined the ability to travel point to point in a timely cost effective way.
It is sad that we still value human life so low that profit is king.

" The legal identity of London Buses is London Bus Services Limited (LBSL), a wholly owned subsidiary of Transport for London."

"TfL as a whole will make an overall £742 million loss in 2019/20, largely due to the record £722 million subsidy needed to run the bus network."
The extension of the ULEZ is about raising revenue to go to Tfl even though the bus service in outer London is sketchy. Basically the outerLondon Boroughs will pay for the travel of those in the inner London boroughs i.e. those most likely to vote for a Labour Mayor.

 

[raynipper]

Drivers wages. Salary: Bus Driver (February, 2023) | Glassdoor

Ray.

 

[Pat-H]

And the average London flat rental is £1500 per month so that's at least £18K gone just on rent. of the £26K average earning that leaves £8K but its less than that the take home on £26K is £21.5K per year.
so that leaves £3.5K a year to live on that's just under £300 per month. For energy bills, food, insurance and all the rest.

 

[raynipper]

It's a wonder we have anyone still working in London then Pat.

Ray.

 

[Pat-H]

Well of course it only works if you have a couple. They can then earn 2 salaries. But you then condemn them to not have children. As childcare cost obliterate the additional earnings.
But I can't see how we have a functional society if we continue this drive to not have children.
Is it a drive to stop the poor having children in an effort to eradicate the poor?

 

[raynipper]

Only in major capital cities I guess.

Ray

 

[erneboy]

Well of course it only works if you have a couple. They can then earn 2 salaries. But you then condemn them to not have children. As childcare cost obliterate the additional earnings.
But I can't see how we have a functional society if we continue this drive to not have children.
Is it a drive to stop the poor having children in an effort to eradicate the poor?

They are likely to continue copulating no matter what barriers are put in their way. It must be some kind of instinct.

 

[Pat-H]

They are likely to continue copulating no matter what barriers are put in their way. It must be some kind of instinct.

Yes and that will stretch their limited resources to breaking point. Ensuring those children grow up disadvantaged.
Hungry at school and struggling to learn. Some will leave school with few qualifications and unable to get higher paying work. So the cycle continues. Some will even turn to crime and cost the state even more.
We used to talk about no children being disadvantaged by the live they are born into but we've seen that's been abandoned completely. If you are born to wealth you are set. If not lives hard.

 

[erneboy]

Perhaps we could improve education in some way. Make it more interesting for those who find it boring. Perhaps we could do better on sex education and access to contraception.

Perhaps we could make work pay better and do away with the gig economy so there are proper jobs.

 

[Pat-H]

Well we had vocational training at one point as an alternative route for those less inclined to academia. But skills based training just isn't trendy.

 

[erneboy]

And yet look at the money builders, plumbers, electricians and so on command.

 

[Pat-H]

And yet look at the money builders, plumbers, electricians and so on command.

Partly because there aren't enough of them to meet demand do they are sought after.

 

[GMJ]

Yes and that will stretch their limited resources to breaking point. Ensuring those children grow up disadvantaged.
Hungry at school and struggling to learn. Some will leave school with few qualifications and unable to get higher paying work. So the cycle continues. Some will even turn to crime and cost the state even more.
We used to talk about no children being disadvantaged by the live they are born into but we've seen that's been abandoned completely. If you are born to wealth you are set. If not lives hard.

This can happen with kids from monied families as well so I'm not sure a broad brush approach is that useful here.

 

[Pat-H]

I don't think kids from well of families dit in school hungry and unable to learn. Granted wealth can bring its own issues but you can buy most solutions to problems.
I think ensuring all children are fed is a very low humanitarian bar that sadly we don't reach.

 

[GMJ]

I can categorically assure you that there were/are kids going to school hungry, from well off families.